After a preflight inspection and engine run up that revealed no anomalies, the private pilot and two passengers were departing on a cross-country flight from the airport in Grants, N.M. The pilot stated that the Piper PA 32R-300 became airborne approximately 5,000′ down the 7,172′ runway at 80 knots.
Approximately 100′ above ground level, he heard a “gurgle” and the engine experienced a loss of power.
The pilot verified that the fuel pump was on and the throttle was in its full-forward position. The pilot then located a forced landing site and during the landing, the airplane hit a tree.
The occupants got out of the airplane, which was subsequently consumed by a post-crash fire.
The accident airport was located at an elevation about 6,500′ mean sea level (msl). Given the atmospheric conditions at the time of the accident, the density altitude exceeded 9,000′ msl, which would have significantly increased the airplane’s takeoff distance and reduced its climb capability.
The pilot’s experience operating in high density altitude environments could not be determined.
Review of photos from the accident site revealed that the fuel selector handle appeared to be located between the left fuel tank and off positions, however, the fuel selector was not examined and its position could not be verified, therefore, the reason for the reported loss of engine power could not be determined.
Probable cause: A loss of engine power for reasons that could not be determined based on the available information.
NTSB Identification: CEN16LA375
This September 2016 accident report is provided by the National Transportation Safety Board. Published as an educational tool, it is intended to help pilots learn from the misfortunes of others.
The 1975 Lance (which is a PA32R-300) the fuel selector is on the floor, not the side wall. And you would have to work hard at stepping on it. Although if you get tangled in your headset cables, I could see how you could, in doing an “emergency” egress from that plane, kick the selector out of its detent.
The chart in my LANCE IM [Think POH] really doesn’t cover the situation as described. But, let’s assume 3200# and do some extrapolation on the chart (which doesn’t even cover the DA given), 4000′ to Vr is not unreasonable.
With a DA of > 9000′ the engine is putting out a MAX of 65% power (per the charts). Per the charts, at 87KIAS (flaps up gear down), you are looking at about 250FPM climb!! Gear up, flaps up, maybe 400′ FPM @ 92 KIAS — this is without knowing OAT (higher temp means less dense air to push around).
That “gurgle” sounds like an engine/fuel problem. So if the pilot had managed to miss the detent and the selector was just past (right or left of the detent), I’m surprised that they even got to rotation speed before the engine was starved of fuel.
If one did the full run up, setting to MAX RPM by adjusting the mixture, that engine should have sucked that line dry during that run up.
You can check it out by using either a Cherokee-6 300 (IO540) or a Normally aspirated LANCE (IO540, no turbo). Start the engine, select “OFF” (fuel selector) and try to taxi. You might make it 100′ before it dies.
There have been a few LANCE aircraft that have lost power or even had the engine just quit, and the problem was (apparently) some kind of contaminate that is part of the 100LL environment that becomes jelly like and will plug injectors (BTDT — 300HP to about 200HP right at rotation during a departure — there was no pull the throttle and stop, we were committed). I didn’t hear any gurgle, I just didn’t have much power and I had to take off to clear a fence to land beyond the runway — but thankfully, it kept developing about 65% so I could clean up and climb enough to come back and land.
A few weeks later the Lance crash at KPDK (Dekalb-Peachtree) took place. The NTSB is who found what we think may be the cause. You get full power, full static run up and with no warning, you have very little power (as in, you went from 100% to maybe 50%). In their case, complete loss of power. In my case two injectors partly plugged so it behaved like about 55%.
I was taking off at about 1000MSL with a DA of about 1600MSL, not an effective 9000 MSL as this pilot experienced. I have had it happen twice, we cleaned the injectors both times. After this second event, it hasn’t happened again for over a year now.
There are three, distinctively different PA-32-300Rs. There is the basic Lance. An honest plane. The “T-Tail” Lance, not so much. And the Saratoga. Honest and pleasant. Regarding Sarah’s comment about ground roll I am guessing she has not flown the T-Tail, only made for a year or two. With a density altitude of 9,000 and a 7,000 ft runway, I don’t think I would attempt take-off in a T-Tail. It’s been a while since I tried, fortunately.
Loss of power does not cause an accident. It is the continuing powerless flight that ends up landing at an undesirable location. It’s not an accident unless there is damage to the aircraft or occupant.
If this aircraft had landed in an open field with no substantial damage, it would not be classified as an accident…however, accidents have nothing to do with engine failure.
You may be right. I see why you don’t understand. But there are quite a few other things you don’t understand about my situation and position back 33 years ago. Plus, I’m far from helpless in the cockpit.
Nuff said.
I’m not that familiar with the PA32-300, but Piper SB 772 requires an inspection to check for loosness of the fuel selector handle. The handle may point to the L or R tank, but the selector valve may be in a position between tanks, or between a tank and the off position. This is something that should be checked during maintenance of all aircraft, not just this Piper.
Secondly, if the selector is on the cockpit floor, as it is in Cessna 310/320 and 400 series aircraft, the handle could be inadvertently kicked or stepped on, moving the selector handle. It’s just the . design. Again, this should be checked immediately before a take off run. A selector valve that is in a midpoint position between tanks or between a tank and “off” will not permit adequate fuel flow, especially at take off power. SB772 states this.
This COULD be the cause, but at this point, who can definitely say?
The fuel selector on the PA32 family of six seat aircraft is on the sidewall to the left of the pilot, down about knee level where it is easy to operate but not within the normal field of view. This is the same as the more common PA28 family which are four place aircraft. I am not sure of the SB applicability but I do recall there was one recently that related to having the tanks misidentified on the selectors label however I do not think such an issue could be responsible for this incident..
A 5000 ft ground roll in a PA32R-300 with just three people onboard? I think that should have been enough of a warning that the aircraft was not performing properly. Yes there was a high density altitude but the report did not make any reference to a calculation of expected ground roll under those conditions during the accident review so we would have a reference point. I have flown that aircraft type and I find it difficult to believe that such a long takeoff roll, more fitting to an airliner, did not raise a red flag while there were still a couple thousand feet left to abort and come to a safe stop then rethink flying that day.
In about 1985, I was to fly with our company “pilot” in a rented Cherokee 6 to go to Virginia to do some STC work on a DHC-7. I had flown with this fellow before, and he was scary!
The aircraft accelerated slowly down the active, and after about 1000 feet it was evident that the tach was a few hundred RPMs shy of redline, and the noise ahead of the firewall wasn’t normal. This guy was adament on flying, as he began “horsing” on the yoke to raise the nose. Fearing for my existence I reached over to the quadrant, chopped the throttle and pulled the mixture. Once stopped, I climbed out and walked the half mile back to the line shack. The rented aircraft wasn’t my responsibilty, but I later checked to find the lower skin on the right wing had been replaced with pop rivets (nothing in the logs) and the aircraft was 6 months out of annual. The local FAA got a call. I never flew with this fellow again!
I do not understand why you would get in a airplane where you said ” I had flown with this fellow before, and he was scary!” Maybe you should rethink things on a stationary park bench.
Quick peek at the POH and 5000ft ground roll at 9000ft density altitude would be expected. There is a reason why the runway is 7100 ft. !